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Author Topic: New column-type thingy  (Read 112314 times)

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Offline The Genuine

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #375 on: March 05, 2012, 03:03:20 PM »
Learning Spanish had an incredible impact on my understanding of English.

English came so naturally to me, as I was raised around it, that I never really paid too much attention in class.  Then, very on early English class moved from the rules of the language to literature and all that fancy stuff.

Having to learn a second language later really caused me to think about the functions of words within a sentence.
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Offline Marianne Dashwood

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #376 on: March 07, 2012, 11:00:42 AM »
When I was in Qing Hua University almost two years ago, my teachers would constantly interrupt my pronunciation, and my awkward diction. My accent changed, as did the words I used in conducting my daily affairs after just a few weeks of influence. They could still pick out my Taiwanese accent, but I definitely started sounding more local by the time I left.

This was your learning a second language, though, which is something totally different.

Learning Spanish had an incredible impact on my understanding of English.

English came so naturally to me, as I was raised around it, that I never really paid too much attention in class.  Then, very on early English class moved from the rules of the language to literature and all that fancy stuff.

Having to learn a second language later really caused me to think about the functions of words within a sentence.

Metalinguistic awareness! :wub:
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Offline Tante Shvester

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #377 on: March 07, 2012, 11:31:58 AM »
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Offline BlackBlade

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #378 on: March 07, 2012, 04:54:48 PM »
When I was in Qing Hua University almost two years ago, my teachers would constantly interrupt my pronunciation, and my awkward diction. My accent changed, as did the words I used in conducting my daily affairs after just a few weeks of influence. They could still pick out my Taiwanese accent, but I definitely started sounding more local by the time I left.

This was your learning a second language, though, which is something totally different.
Why should it be? If I was enrolled in a "Rhetoric" or "Public Speaking" course it would have the same effect.
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Offline Marianne Dashwood

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #379 on: March 07, 2012, 05:52:33 PM »
Because Chinese is your second language.

eta: A rhetoric class in your native language might affect how you speak in certain situations, but it wouldn't affect how you spoke at home or with your friends. Native, everyday language is very unsusceptible to external mandate. It is, however, very susceptible to peer groups and culture. We weren't originally talking about rhetoric classes, though, we were talking about English teachers.

This is a very touchy subject for me because of some of the crazy political nonsense that's going on recently. Arizona was trying to pass a regulation that teachers who spoke with "foreign accents" couldn't teach elementary school because they would teach the students nonstandard English. One of my linguistics professors posted on facebook a letter written by a coalition of linguists repudiating, point by point, the ridiculous assumptions of that policy. I was trying to find that letter but I haven't been able to again.
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Offline Porter

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #380 on: March 07, 2012, 06:28:55 PM »
Quote
A rhetoric class in your native language might affect how you speak in certain situations, but it wouldn't affect how you spoke at home or with your friends.
It did for me.
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Offline Jonathon

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #381 on: March 07, 2012, 06:31:35 PM »
Yeah, but you're weird. ;)
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Offline BlackBlade

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #382 on: March 07, 2012, 10:03:56 PM »
Because Chinese is your second language.

eta: A rhetoric class in your native language might affect how you speak in certain situations, but it wouldn't affect how you spoke at home or with your friends. Native, everyday language is very unsusceptible to external mandate. It is, however, very susceptible to peer groups and culture. We weren't originally talking about rhetoric classes, though, we were talking about English teachers.

This is a very touchy subject for me because of some of the crazy political nonsense that's going on recently. Arizona was trying to pass a regulation that teachers who spoke with "foreign accents" couldn't teach elementary school because they would teach the students nonstandard English. One of my linguistics professors posted on facebook a letter written by a coalition of linguists repudiating, point by point, the ridiculous assumptions of that policy. I was trying to find that letter but I haven't been able to again.
Annie, I for one don't believe there really is a "standard English". I have no problem with people with accents teaching English because by and large there is so much shared media it creates a sort of standard we can reference when we speak to each other, rather than pockets of America where there are more and more distinct accents and vocabulary.

But you are talking to somebody whose accent and speech patterns are very fluid. When I talk to people I quickly pick up on mannerisms and methods of speaking. It makes people more comfortable in many instances. I have a completely different voice (for lack of a better term) for each one of my siblings. I've always been that way as long as I can remember. I get that I might be a bit of an anomaly to a significant extent, but I am also convinced that if one took a class where they were taught rhetorical principles and how to speak in public, you would find that adjusting your speech patterns is a skill just like any other. If instead of foreign languages we insisted on foreign accents in school, people would be quite capable of completely adjusting their accent and sticking with the new accent even as their primary voice.

When I took a rhetorical class in high school, my teacher told me that I had a weakness with using inappropriately advanced words when speaking to an audience. To a great extent I was proud of my vocabulary, and frequently used five dollar words when speaking. I had to spend the entire semester working on it, it was crazy hard to not use those words but also not sound like I was speaking like my audience was full of dumb people. Since then, and this is still true today, I'm much better at adjusting my word set depending on who I speak to.

Again, that's all on top of my accent, and manner of speaking.
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Offline pooka

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #383 on: March 08, 2012, 10:36:49 PM »
The good news is that there is a standard English.  The bad news is that the only native speaker was William Shakespeare.  

I'll back any law for that. 
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his work."  Comte de Saint-Simon

Offline BlackBlade

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #384 on: March 09, 2012, 12:51:27 PM »
By my troth! Thy babelings instruct fools to silence, and wisemen to their trembling. Shall a man raise his voice against the storms' thunderous accusations? Or the frenzied railings of the mad? I say unto thee - Nay! Nay! :)
« Last Edit: September 28, 2013, 10:28:55 PM by BlackBlade »
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Offline Jonathon

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #385 on: March 09, 2012, 01:54:06 PM »
The good news is that there is a standard English.  The bad news is that the only native speaker was William Shakespeare.  

I'll back any law for that. 

 :D
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Offline Brinestone

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #386 on: March 10, 2012, 06:18:41 AM »
Is that King Lear?
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Offline BlackBlade

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #387 on: March 10, 2012, 07:24:12 AM »
Is that King Lear?
Nah, I just made it up. I wish I could type stuff like that out in under 3 minutes.
Kyrgyzstan, is the homeland of the Kyrgyzs, a people best known for cheating at Scrabble. -Tante Shvester

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Offline Brinestone

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #388 on: March 10, 2012, 11:39:42 AM »
Wow. That was pretty convincing!
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Offline BlackBlade

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #389 on: March 10, 2012, 05:03:27 PM »
*bows* :)
Kyrgyzstan, is the homeland of the Kyrgyzs, a people best known for cheating at Scrabble. -Tante Shvester

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Offline Jonathon

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #390 on: March 19, 2012, 03:05:42 PM »
A slightly different sort of post (because now I'm a corporate shill): How to Write Better.
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Offline Porter

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #391 on: March 19, 2012, 04:00:12 PM »
I always dreamed of the day you'd sell out.

*wipes tear*
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Offline Jonathon

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #392 on: March 19, 2012, 04:29:40 PM »
Really, isn't that every writer's dream?

It's especially funny that I agree to write this post in exchange for a $50 Amazon gift card the week before I was asked to write an article that will pay 19 times as much.
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Offline Porter

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #393 on: March 19, 2012, 06:05:44 PM »
Good things come to those who sell out. :)
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Offline Jonathon

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #394 on: March 19, 2012, 06:12:51 PM »
good things == money?
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Offline rivka

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #395 on: March 19, 2012, 07:00:36 PM »
I thought that was the root of all evil?

(Yeah, yeah, I know money is != love of money.)
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Offline pooka

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #396 on: March 19, 2012, 11:27:31 PM »
Well, we are talking about selling out here.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his work."  Comte de Saint-Simon

Offline Jonathon

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #397 on: March 30, 2012, 10:30:55 AM »
You underestimate my ability to take things seriously!

Offline rivka

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #398 on: March 30, 2012, 10:38:56 AM »
 B)
"Sometimes you need a weirdo to tell you that things have gotten weird. Your normal friends, neighbors, and coworkers won’t tell you."
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Offline BlackBlade

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Re: New column-type thingy
« Reply #399 on: March 30, 2012, 11:22:17 AM »
I knew Jon Boy before he was almost famous, and every point after that until he goes mad with fame, spirals, and then I'll have never known him.
Kyrgyzstan, is the homeland of the Kyrgyzs, a people best known for cheating at Scrabble. -Tante Shvester

What, you expected us to be badly injured or dead, and flying blind to boot? You're the one who told us all to be Awesome. -Brinestone