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Forums => English & Linguistics => Topic started by: Annie Subjunctive on October 17, 2004, 10:21:30 PM

Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Annie Subjunctive on October 17, 2004, 10:21:30 PM: I can't count how many times in conversation when I mention that I speak French, people ask "so do you know any good swear words? Dude, if I were you, I would cuss people out and they couldn't understand what it meant."

Why is this such a common response? Why on earth would I want to cuss someone out in a language they couldn't understand? I'm pretty sure if I were mad enough to want to use strong language at someone, I would want them to understand exactly what it meant.

Yet I hear this all the time....

(on another note: I should really go to bed.)
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 18, 2004, 06:25:06 AM: Huh. I never get that response when people learn I speak Portugese. Two possible reasons:

1) It never takes long for them to figure out or learn that I was there as a missionary, and if missionary was busy learning swear words, they'd rather not know.

2) It's French specifically (the language of love) that they get a kick out of knowing swear words for. It seems that you could be saying the most romantic things to somebody in German, and it would sound like you are cussing them out, but you could be cussing them out in French, and it sounds like you're saying something cool. As many issues as I have with French culture (in many ways, it has become what I am most afraid American culture will some day become) and the French language (It seems to be a language specifically engineered to make sure that those d**n foreigners from learning it properly*), I still have to admit that French sounds way cool when spoken.

* I'm mostly kidding about that, but it seems like that sometimes. Why is French pronounced so differently from the other languages that use our alphabet? Why does it seem that over half of all letters in the language are silent?

Concerning 1), there were some missionaries who went out of their way to learn all the swear words. I was never one of them. But about halfway through my mission, my companion made sure that he taught them all to me. Not with junior high type motivations (tee hee! these words are naughty!), but because he felt that it was important to be able to know what people are saying.

It turned out to be a really good thing that I knew some of the cruder words later in my mission.

Sometimes, especially when playing board games, I do "swear" in Portugese, but never using actual Portugese swear words. I just say things like "son of a mother" or "how rotten". It's not really swearing, but it's nice to have an explitive that everybody at the table doesn't automatically know isn't really an explitive (like darn and fetchin' heck!).
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Kama on October 18, 2004, 01:40:32 PM: It's nice to know Portuguese swearwords when you're working in a Portuguese company.

At least you know you're being talked dirty to. Not that I ever was. :lol:
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 18, 2004, 06:00:09 PM: Quote
I'm mostly kidding about that, but it seems like that sometimes. Why is French pronounced so differently from the other languages that use our alphabet? Why does it seem that over half of all letters in the language are silent?
It seems to me that it's really not all that different; at least, I wouldn't say it's more different from English than any other language is. The consonant system of French is close to that of English, and the vowel system isn't too different, considering that French has vowel sounds that English doesn't have (and vice versa).

The real problem is the silent letters, but that's a problem that English has, too. The simple fact is that French pronunciation has changed faster than its spelling, and once you have a spelling system established, it's difficult to change. It's also good to note that though French probably has more silent letters in its spelling system, the rules about when they're silent are far more consistent than the rules in English.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Hobbes on October 19, 2004, 04:45:01 AM: Some people know how to say hello in 30 languages, some know how to curse a blue streak in 30 languages, I think it has a lot to do with how one approachs the world. Most of the guys I knew in high school were of the latter category. <_<

Hobbes :)
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Brinestone on October 19, 2004, 10:33:24 AM: Hmm. I just had an idea of how to respond. What if you find phrases, like Porter's, that sound like swear words but aren't? And then when someone asks you if you know any swear words and says it would be fun to cuss someone out in a language they don't know, respond with something like this:

"Du bist ein Dummkopf! Ich kann nicht glauben, dass du so haesslich bist. Du kannst nicht mich verstanden! Hahahahaha!"

It's just an idea.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: sarcasticmuppet on October 19, 2004, 10:54:05 AM: Ishitta dam talaat ish-hore fuqat.

I *love* that phrase. :wub:
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: pooka on October 19, 2004, 02:19:10 PM: You should try teaching them a phrase that they think is swear words but really means "I like to wear pink sockies with a lacey fringe". That way if they ever try to cuss out a French person they will get laughted at. Or teach them "cacahuettes". It sounds dirty. It isn't, is it? It means peanuts, right?
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Annie Subjunctive on October 19, 2004, 02:58:57 PM: Pooka, you have just won 50 French points. There were until just now three words that I knew in Spanish, but not French, and you have just reduced that number to 2. (I know I could have looked them up, but I wanted to see if I could figure it out.) Cachuette makes sense, since the Spanish is cacahuate.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Brinestone on October 19, 2004, 07:26:21 PM: Cachuette is pronounced vaguely like "cash-wet," right? I'm guessing it's related to "cashew," then, and a peanut is a little cashew. I wonder. . . .

*checks OED*

Edit: Hmmm. That was no help. All it says is that the word cashew comes from the Old French word acajou.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Annie Subjunctive on October 19, 2004, 09:31:16 PM: Nope, it looks like that's a spelling error that takes away all resemblance to cashew. It should be cacahuète or cacahouète, and the peanut plant is called an arachide.

A cashew is a noix de cajou, while the cashew tree is called the anacardier. This is not to be confused with the acajou tree, which is grown for its ornamental wood. The etymology of cajou, from this page (http://www.saveurs.sympatico.ca/ency_4/noix/cajou.htm), is Brazilian in origin:
Quote
Étymologie et terminologie
Cajou: "acaïou", mot tupi, une langue commune à une tribu brésilienne

Anacardier: du grec "kardia" signifiant coeur

Si l'anacardier est également surnommé "acajou à pommes" (selon le dictionnaire Larousse), il n'a rien à voir avec l'acajou, arbre dont le bois rouge est utilisé en menuiserie et en ébénisterie.

Le faux fruit ou pédoncule est appelé fruit cajou ou pomme cajou

More French fun! (as long as we're namin' nuts):
noix = nut in general, or more specifically, walnut
noisette = hazelnut
noix de macadamia = macadamia nut
amande = almond
marron = chestnut
pacane (also: noix de pécan) = pecan
pistache = pistachio

And remember the most important lesson of all:
Quote
Il ne faut pas confondre les noix avec les arachides même si elles sont souvent mélangées dans le bol des grignotines. Les noix sont des fruits tandis que l'arachide est une légumineuse.
Do NOT mistake peanuts for nuts! They are legumes!
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: saxon75 on October 20, 2004, 08:04:35 AM: Quick mini-poll: do people around where you live pronounce the L in the word almond?
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: TheTick on October 20, 2004, 08:48:29 AM: Uh, how else would you pronounce it? Ah-mond? That's just dorky.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 20, 2004, 08:54:45 AM: I pronounce the l.

But then, I pronounce the t in mountain and button.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: saxon75 on October 20, 2004, 09:04:17 AM: Believe it or not, Tick, there are many people in the world that not only pronounce it "ah-mond" but also don't tend to hear the fact that other people pronounce the L. In Canada (in the Toronto/London area, at least), most people not only leave out the L but also pronounce the A with a "short" sound, as in the word ask.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Lady Montagu on October 20, 2004, 09:56:02 AM: How do you pronounce pecan?

puhKAHN

or

PEEcan

?
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 20, 2004, 10:10:59 AM: I say "AHL-muhnd" and "pih-KAHN." I really don't know if everyone around here says them like that.

http://hcs.harvard.edu/~golder/dialect/staticmaps/q_29.html (http://hcs.harvard.edu/~golder/dialect/staticmaps/q_29.html)

http://hcs.harvard.edu/~golder/dialect/staticmaps/q_21.html (http://hcs.harvard.edu/~golder/dialect/staticmaps/q_21.html)

My answers are a and f, respectively. Or maybe d on the almond question. It's sort of a weak l sound.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 20, 2004, 11:31:19 AM: The Pecan is the state tree of Texas. When we discusssed that in seventh grade, the teacher (I hate coach teachers) mocked me for saying pee-cawn instead of pee-can.

<-- still scarred
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 20, 2004, 11:32:58 AM: Those are the same.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 20, 2004, 11:45:52 AM: Not anymore.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 20, 2004, 11:54:20 AM: That's odd, because according to the survey, over 80 percent of Texans say it with the "ah" sound. The conclusion: your teacher was dumb.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: sarcasticmuppet on October 20, 2004, 12:00:29 PM: Do I really need to break down what a pee-can is?
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 20, 2004, 12:00:46 PM: Oh, he was not the brightest.

<-- still bitter about crappy coach teachers
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: sarcasticmuppet on October 20, 2004, 12:04:46 PM: *knows what a crappy coach teacher is, and teachers who didn't even have the excuse that they were coaches to make up for their awesomely horrible teaching*

*is also bitter*
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 20, 2004, 12:44:25 PM: Many of my coach teachers I am convinced picked on the nerdy kids when they were in school, and continued to pick on us after they became teachers.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Annie Subjunctive on October 20, 2004, 03:16:00 PM: My family is from Texas and grew pecans for a while, and they have always been pi-KAWNs. Actually, the hickest of the cousins call them KAWNs.

"Ah got a sack uh kawns here for ye"
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: pooka on October 20, 2004, 04:49:16 PM: So is cacahuettes not french? Do I lose my french points? All I know is my sister set the word to music. It could easily have been the spanish word.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 20, 2004, 05:50:43 PM: According to BabelFish, the French word for peanut is arachide.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Annie Subjunctive on October 20, 2004, 08:30:02 PM: Cacahuètes is French... pronounced the same way. You just misspelled it.

And JB, arachide is the peanut plant, and can also mean the nuts, though the salted, toasty nuts for eating are cacahuètes.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Anna on October 21, 2004, 09:06:17 AM: Babelfish isn't always the good answer to your foreign languages questions :)
People would look at you in a weird way if you asked "Puis-je avoir des arachides, s'il vous plait".
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 21, 2004, 09:17:09 AM: Tricksy Babelfish!
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Sheila on October 21, 2004, 09:30:31 AM: Bill also suffered through coach teachers. His school fired a good history teacher because he was a bad football coach and hired a good coach who taught art, though I feel like I'm misleading you by phrasing that in a way that implies he actually did anything. The replacement history teacher, who coached baseball if I recall correctly, argued that the 2 bombs were fat man and fat boy. Citing the text did not disuade him. Don't even ask about Joe Navark.

If you two ever do meet, I highly recommend trading coach teacher stories to get past the introverted interface he presents.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: TheTick on October 21, 2004, 09:37:59 AM: I had a coach teacher that did the 'family life aka sex ed' in my health class. Fun times that.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 21, 2004, 10:11:03 AM: Crappy coach teachers I've had (I've never had a good one):

6th grade science
7th grade science
7th grade history
8th grade science
11th grade history
12th grade psych

I have a lot of crappy coach stories I could tell.

But I won't.

At least not now.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 21, 2004, 10:29:22 AM: I've had a surprising number of good coach teachers. One of my favorite teachers was my calculus teacher in twelfth grade, and he was a tennis coach. But it seems to me that there's a big difference between coaches who are also teachers and teachers who are also coaches. A few of mine were the former, but I think most were the latter.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Sheila on October 21, 2004, 10:32:21 AM: Not one of you has laughed at "Joe Navark." Come on people, that's Georging hilarious.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 21, 2004, 10:38:34 AM: :lol:

So what's up with Joe Navark?
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Sheila on October 21, 2004, 10:42:24 AM: He was inspired by God to lead French troops. Don't you know anything about history? :rolleyes: :lol: :ph34r:
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 21, 2004, 10:43:33 AM: Apparently not.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Brinestone on October 21, 2004, 10:53:32 AM: I had to say it out loud before I got it, celia. I'm going to have to research this guy; he sounds cool.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Anna on October 21, 2004, 11:36:43 AM: I sure never heard about this guy. Canadian maybe ?
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 21, 2004, 12:24:36 PM: What, they don't teach you history in France? :rolleyes:
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Anna on October 21, 2004, 01:00:49 PM: Of course they do. I work in a school, so I should know ! But obviously, they don't teach you French. We learn French when we're babies !
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on October 21, 2004, 02:12:24 PM: I'm just teasing you. :P

Joe Navark = Joan of Arc = Jeanne d'Arc
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Porter on October 21, 2004, 04:27:44 PM: Joe Nevark is my new alias that I'm using whenever I wear my armor.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: sarcasticmuppet on October 21, 2004, 06:11:09 PM: I assume it's a nametag sort of alias rather than a spoken one.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Anna on October 22, 2004, 01:53:09 AM: We call her "Jeanne d'Arc", which sounds a lot different, that must be why I didn't realize the trick :)
But that's no excuse because I heard how English speaker name her in a Leonard Cohen's song.
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: imogen on November 14, 2004, 05:49:34 AM: I didn't get it either, Anna.

I think that may because when I read words I pronounce them in my head in a crazy-Imogen way that only rarely gets spoken.

And I say PEE-CAN. And AH-MOND. And I love love love French culture. :P
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: imogen on November 14, 2004, 05:51:53 AM: Actually, on reflection it's more like Ah-MUND.

I'd probably be able to write it more accurately if I actually knew the whole capital/emphasis deal. :)
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Noemon on November 14, 2004, 09:16:15 AM: AHLmund

puhKHAN
Title: "I speak a foreign language." How do you respond?
Post by: Jonathon on November 14, 2004, 09:46:39 AM: Quote
Actually, on reflection it's more like Ah-MUND.

I'd probably be able to write it more accurately if I actually knew the whole capital/emphasis deal. :)
capitalization = stress

I'm guessing you say "AH-mund."