GalacticCactus Forum
Forums => English & Linguistics => Topic started by: Jonathon on March 11, 2005, 01:16:11 PM
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The sentence is "The subject is not being acted on."
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Do we get a prize if we get it right?
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I want to change my vote.
No matter what, it's a terrible sentence.
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If you get it right, you get the satisfaction of knowing that you know more than the staff member from Chicago who answered my email today. :P
Actually, I just wanted to see how well people understand the difference between active and passive voice in non-simple verb conjugations. I know it's a terrible sentence, but that's not the point.
So that's a change from passive to active, Kat?
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Can you tell us the difference after you're done your poll?
I'm clueless towards anything language related :huh:
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Yeah, I'll explain when it's over.
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At first, I thought "this sentence" meant the question itself. I was totally confused as to what tricky thing I was supposed to discover.
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So did I. I kept thinking of the statement "This statement is false."
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Sorry about that. I hope I didn't throw anybody off too much.
The correct answer is passive.
The passive is formed when the past participle (the form of the verb that usually goes with have, as in "have kicked," "have eaten," and so on) is joined with a form of be (like "was kicked," "is being eaten," and so on). This has the effect of flipping the subject and object around.
I kicked the ball.
The ball was kicked by me.
Students are often told to avoid the passive like the plague because it can lead to weak, awkward writing. However, there are legitimate uses for the passive—I used it in the last sentence ("students are told") because the students are the important part, not the person doing the telling (compare it to "Teachers often tell students . . .").
The reason for all this is that there's a very gross error concerning the passive voice in The Chicago Manual of Style. Section 5.113 states, "If an inflected form of to be is joined with the verb's present participle, a progressive conjugation is produced {the ox is pulling the cart}. The progressive conjugation is in active voice because the subject is performing the action, not being acted on" (emphasis added).
It's inaccurate to say that progressive constructions are always active, especially since the author uses a passive progressive construction at the end of the paragraph. So I e-mailed Chicago about it, and this is the response I got:
Yes, I think perhaps you are misunderstanding the point here. Section 5.113 seeks to prevent an inaccurate extension of 5.112, which states that "the passive voice is always formed by joining an inflected form of to be (or, in colloquial usage, to get) with the verb's past participle." In 5.113, CMS points out that phrases like "the subject is not being acted on," which might look passive, are actually constructed with a present participle, rather than a past participle, and are active in voice. (Note that the subject--the word "subject"--is performing the action of not being; this is active, not passive.)
Thank you for writing--
Staff
The section in the manual is confusing and somewhat inaccurate, but the staff's defense of it is just flat-out wrong. They say that it's constructed with a present participle, not a past participle, but it has both. Then they say that it's the subject of not being, but they leave out the past participle again—it's really the object of not being acted on.
So if you got the answer right, congratulations: you officially know more about the passive voice than the staff members at The Chicago Manual of Style.
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I needed another option.. like...
Who gives a crap.
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The answer to your original question seemed obvious, but I don't understand anything in that last post of yours, JB.
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Like, "You used too many technical terms that I don't know," or like "You can't write your way out of a paper bag, Jon Boy"? Hopefully it's the former.
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To Chicago: :P :P :P
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more like "Jon and Chicago used lots of technical terms that I didn't understand".
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Tough technical terms were used by Jon Boy and Chicago. :P
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Let's see if I can help at all.
passive = be + past participle
inflected = not infinitive (in this instance), so inflected forms of to be are is, am, are, was, were, being, been
present participle = -ing verb (going, eating, sleeping)
past participle = form of verb usually used with have (have gone, have eaten, have slept)
progressive: A sentence that is progressive has a present participle in it. So, Lucy is watching her favorite soap opera is progressive because of is watching.
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good to know I didn't spend 5 years at university for nothin.
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I suggest writing them back and saying "Do not go up against Jon Boy in a grammar war when death is on the line!"
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Except that they really don't seem to realize that it's wrong. Here's what I wrote back:
I'm sorry, but "is being acted on" is definitely in the passive voice. Compare it to constructions like "is acted on," "has been acted on," "will be acted on," and so on. It contains a form of "to be" ("being") plus a past participle ("acted").
Thus, in that sentence, "subject" is the patient (or object) of the verb phrase "is being acted on (by something)." The implied "by something" is the true agent (or subject) of the verb. As a further example, this site (http://owl.english.purdue.edu/handouts/grammar/g_passive.html) has a chart showing all passive forms with their corresponding active forms (including progressive constructions).
This is why I was wondering about 5.113. It is simply inaccurate and misleading to say that progressive constructions cannot be used with the passive voice.
And here's their response:
Well, I've done my best to defend Mr. Garner's take on the subject, but I'll be happy to add your letter to our file of suggested corrections and additions to CMS. If you wish to explore this question further, you might take the matter up with experts at grammar Web sites and help pages. Meanwhile, please write us again if you have a question about Chicago style. --Staff
It's like he's not even considering the possibility that Garner is wrong. And then he tells me to go ask some experts for help! Gah!
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ask as many experts as you possibly can, then copy all their responses and send them to Chicago.
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You know, that just might work. :pirate:
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:lol:
I think I'll do that.
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I was confuzzled the same way Annie was. >_<
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Yay! I got it right! All I had to do was think, "would I write this sentence? hmmm, yes I would. then it must be passive."
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:lol: You sciency types are all alike.
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the person that did edit my prelim right at the last minute wrote "don't use passive" so many times that he eventually shortened it to "passive" over and over and over again. i like to imagine him rocking in a corner with his eyes flickering around chanting "passivetensepassivetense" over and over.
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Cool! It let me vote twice under the same login! ;)
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Actually, it's the passive voice, not the passive tense.
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screw you, it's my fantasy!
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You need a better fantasy life, my friend.
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i didn't say it was my *only* fantasy.
and i was expecting you to say something about it being a financial planning service away from another fantasy. :innocent:
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If I remembered what you were referring to, I most likely would have. ;)