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Forums => English & Linguistics => Topic started by: Brinestone on June 24, 2010, 07:10:18 AM

Title: If I lay here
Post by: Brinestone on June 24, 2010, 07:10:18 AM

For years I've been trying to decide how much Snow Patrol's lyrics to "Chasing Cars" bug me. I thought they were, "If I lay here, if I just lay here, would you lay with me and just forget the world?" I mean, yeah, it's wrong, but it's the way everyone says it now. How much value is there in preserving the lay/lie distinction?

The other day I noticed that there's a tiny difference in pronunciation in the last "lay." In fact, I thought that maybe it was "lie" instead. Which would mean that the "lay" they're using in the rest of the song is not the present-tense conditional of the verb "lay," but rather the subjunctive form of "lie," which is, indeed, "lay."

Try substituting a different verb: "If I stayed here, if I just stayed here, would you stay with me?"

Turns out there's nothing wrong with Snow Patrol's grammar or word usage after all. Problem is, I still am not sure how I feel about the lay/lie distinction.

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: Scott R on June 24, 2010, 07:15:23 AM

Lay it on me.

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: BlackBlade on June 24, 2010, 07:42:59 AM

There are layers of meaning to Scott's post.

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: Jonathon on June 24, 2010, 09:57:55 AM

I don't think it actually is a subjunctive. That would require it to be counterfactual, and the second half of the sentence makes it clear that it's not. He's asking her to stay with him if he stays; it doesn't make sense for him to ask her to stay if he had stayed.

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: pooka on June 28, 2010, 09:33:22 PM

When I try and hear the song in my head, I'm mixing up the lays and lies left and right.  Like, I was sure it was "Would you lie with me" but as I was telling my husband which song we were talking about, I also said "If I lie here."  It's not that I distinguish between lay and lie particularly well.  I think I use lie where I shouldn't sometimes.  Or maybe since I have known the rule longer than I didn't know it, it finally stuck.  But I remember thinking it was a pretty dumb rule when I was in high school.

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: spacepook on July 23, 2010, 03:17:40 PM

I sing it as "If I lay here/ If I just lay here/ Would you lie with me/ And just forget the world".

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: Annie Subjunctive on July 24, 2010, 04:10:22 AM

They should have said "Were I to lay here."

That's it. I'm writing vehement fanmail.

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: pooka on July 24, 2010, 06:30:38 PM

 :D

Title: Re: If I lay here
Post by: The Genuine on July 24, 2010, 08:12:11 PM

Are you dancer?